609. Fighting Depression and Discouragement

[00:00:06] This is Lead To Serve with Ed Taylor, A Leadership Podcast.

[00:00:11] Welcome again to another episode of the Lead To Serve Podcast with Pastor Ed Taylor. That's me. I'm your host for the season. I'm host of the podcast. This is season number six. We're trying to be a little or a lot more intentional in getting these podcasts done. That is Bob. By the way, Bob Claycamp is in studio with me this season. Welcome again, Bob.

[00:00:36] Yeah, here we are.

[00:00:37] Bob, that's the number one complaint that we have on Lead To Serve is that we don't do it often enough. And to knock out two seasons in one year is pretty good considering the amount of responsibility and work that we have around here.

[00:00:59] And I appreciate you rearranging your schedule to make this work. I rearranged my schedule to make this work. And it's fun. The idea of the Lead To Serve podcast is like you're joining us in the office.

[00:01:11] We're sitting in a studio here with microphones in front of us, but we're actually just looking at each other, talking or thinking in our minds. What can we say? As if you were in the office with us, as you were in studio with us and we were talking life and ministry.

[00:01:27] A lot of the topics of Lead To Serve come from you guys. They come from ministry experience, life experience. I mean, we could easily go, if we had more time, we could go more and more on these topics that come from emails.

[00:01:46] I get, I got an email yesterday about this topic of closure. And I have a theory of closure. I don't think it exists because of sin. And I think it's another elusive thing that frustrates people because you never get it. You never get it only at the cross. But that's another topic. That's not our topic today.

[00:02:07] But a brother emailed me yesterday talking about how hard it's been in his life that he couldn't come to closure. And so I said, here, I want you to think about this. And then we're going to talk about it after you pray over it. I want to make a suggestion in your mind that there's no such thing as closure. And I gave him a brief explanation and then let's talk about it.

[00:02:29] And whether you agree with it or not, it becomes a point where the Holy Spirit can meet us in the scriptures where you can find that the true closure to hurt, to pain, to injustice is truly in the presence of God. He's the one, he's the final arbiter. He's the final judge. So that could be a topic. Because I just came in an email last night from a brother who I know that has been struggling for years.

[00:02:56] And the Lord is, but I can see at the same time, God's bringing him out. So that's the Lead to Serve podcast. A lot of the topics, they're real and raw because this is where the rubber meets the road, if you will, in life's experiences and how do we apply them.

[00:03:14] And so in light of the leader, the podcast also has a bent toward leadership, servant leadership, following Mark chapter 10, verse 15. We're pastors. So if you're new to the podcast, we're pastors. So we're taking biblical principles.

[00:03:29] And you might even be listening right now and you're not a Christian or you don't have anything to do with church and you're shocked. And I hope you are. You're shocked that the Bible actually has a great relevance to how you, how you lead at work or how you are able to lead at home.

[00:03:49] And here's the shock value. You ready? The shock value is that God has your attention. And because he has your attention, he wants you to come into a relationship with him. And he's used your leadership or desire for leadership skills. And you're listening in like, these are counterintuitive, aren't they? These aren't like the latest leadership training you got at work that HR put on for you.

[00:04:15] Although sometimes HR will pick up on something and they'll do a seminar. Like we're going to teach you how to be servant leaders when actually it's a biblical principle. It's not an HR principle. But at any rate, we're glad if you're not a follower of Jesus Christ, we want you to be, but we're so glad that you're tuned in.

[00:04:33] You're listening to two pastors with a combined 80 years plus of walking with the Lord and almost 80 years plus of serving God in high level capacities in his church. And we want you to be a part of it. I know a lot of our audience already knows us. Welcome back. Our goal is to help you grow in servant leadership.

[00:04:53] We want you to glorify God in all that you do. And these discussions are like being in the office with us. And we're coming up on our next topic. They've all seemed to be woven together, but the topic today is depression. Depression. I'm not getting into clinical definitions and diagnoses. We're pastors. We're not doctors, psychologists, or psychiatrists.

[00:05:18] So let's set that aside for a second. And we will just talk about discouragement or being deeply in pain, having feelings. We could call it depression. You could call it discouragement. You could call it depth of melancholy. As we looked in a previous episode where it is just this down, you know, maybe if you watch cartoons, you're not Tigger.

[00:05:48] You're your Eeyore. And you have feelings like that. And we want to acknowledge them. Again, we'll go back to definitions. A typical dictionary definition of depression is this. Feelings of severe despondency and dejection. Self-doubt. And then it goes on to a mental condition.

[00:06:12] And we, you know, you could call it mental illness. But we all suffer from mental illness. And that's because we were born with a broken brain. Sin broke our brain. None of us are what we intended, what God intended, I should say, because of the sin that happened in the Garden of Eden.

[00:06:34] So all of us suffer. And that is not a statement. And you'll understand as this goes on, this podcast episode goes on, this is not a statement in any way trying to minimize the medical side of this, the mental side of this.

[00:06:51] Because I'm not, that is not my intent at all. So just at the outset, I do believe God has helped me to be careful on this topic because of what I've personally experienced, but also God's heart on the matter.

[00:07:06] So my experience doesn't trump God's heart on the matter. God always goes first, but I'm not trying to minimize things, but I'm also not trying to over maximize.

[00:07:16] What does the Bible have to say? How can we come into terms with these feelings, not only a failure, like we've talked about last time, but also feelings of depression, discouragement, being downcast.

[00:07:31] You know, how David would say, why are you, he talked to himself, he goes, why are you so downcast? And there's reasons for that. But Bob, you had a thought, and let's just start, let's go right to the, right to this thought that you had.

[00:07:43] And that, that is explaining the difference between depression, oppression. Give us your insights on that.

[00:07:50] Well, in thinking about it, to me, depression is more of an internal reality that I can fall into. Oppression seems to be something from the outside that, as you said earlier, could lead to depression.

[00:08:11] You can't control things that happen to you or people that have turned to be your enemy or they decide to stab you in the back after you've done so many good things.

[00:08:23] You've been with them at the birth of their child. You've been with them. You've dedicated the child. You helped them through the marriage issues.

[00:08:30] And then all of a sudden they stabbed you in the back because they didn't like how you said something.

[00:08:36] And it just doesn't make any sense. And the more that you begin to ponder it and roll it over in your mind, the injustice, the unfairness, it works all kinds of things.

[00:08:50] And then Satan is right there to use all that as a hook to pull you into his quicksand, to destroy all hope.

[00:09:00] So that oppression from the outside is something, as part of the spiritual warfare that we go through, it's diabolical, demonic.

[00:09:09] And so we have to be on guard with the tools that God has given us. And there's one definition of oppression, a sense of being weighed down in body or mind.

[00:09:22] And so where do you go when you start feeling that way and you feel like the quicksand is grabbing your ankles and pulling you down?

[00:09:31] And that's where you go to the Psalms, especially Psalm 42, Psalm 43.

[00:09:37] Why are you cast down, O my soul? Why are you disquieted within me? Hope thou in God, for I shall yet praise him, who is the help of my countenance and my God.

[00:09:47] And so understand that even Paul the Apostle had times where he had a despair of life.

[00:09:56] And he writes about it in 2 Corinthians 1 verse 8. It says,

[00:10:02] We do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, of our trouble which came to us in Asia, that we were burdened beyond measure, above strength, so that we despaired even of life.

[00:10:20] And then he says, yes, we had the sentence of death in ourselves, that we should not trust in ourselves, but in God who raises the dead.

[00:10:34] I mean, what's the worst that can happen?

[00:10:35] Well, you die. That's the worst that can happen.

[00:10:39] Well, wait a minute. God raises the dead.

[00:10:41] So it's not, you know, it's just we don't like the process. That's all.

[00:10:44] It says,

[00:10:45] Who delivered us from so great a death and does deliver us, in whom we trust that he will still deliver us.

[00:10:54] That's past, present, and future.

[00:10:56] You also helping together in prayer for us, that thanks may be given by many persons on our behalf for the gift granted to us through many.

[00:11:07] Yeah.

[00:11:07] Sometimes we forget how important intercessory prayer is for someone who just feels like they're in the quicksand and being pulled down.

[00:11:16] And we want to think, okay, how can I help them?

[00:11:21] Well, the first step is going to God with them.

[00:11:24] Yeah.

[00:11:24] Because he has the strategy. He knows what's going on more than we do. And that intercessory prayer is something God chooses to use. Although he didn't, he doesn't have to use it. I mean, he can do what he wants.

[00:11:37] Yeah.

[00:11:38] But he's chosen to do certain things through the intercessory prayers of his people.

[00:11:43] So let's go back to you used an illustration twice that I don't know if you realize you used it, but I'm listening to you. You used the illustration of quicksand twice.

[00:11:52] Right.

[00:11:52] Have you ever been in quicksand?

[00:11:53] Oh, yeah.

[00:11:54] You haven't.

[00:11:55] Not real quicksand.

[00:11:56] Okay. So yeah, you haven't been in real quicksand, but then in your mind and imagination, maybe I'm seeing it in a television show or something.

[00:12:02] Right.

[00:12:02] It becomes an illustration of discouragement and depression. And you have quite literally felt that in ministry in life.

[00:12:11] Oh, on a number of occasions.

[00:12:11] Take us a little bit into, before I share my side or a season where I've been in, take us into a season you've been in, this quicksand kind of feeling like you've been pulled down with no way out.

[00:12:25] Well, I think when I was pastoring in Phoenix, there were a few times I now look at them as being pulled through a knot hole where everything gets stripped away.

[00:12:36] You're changing illustrations.

[00:13:07] And so it is gone.

[00:13:10] And so it is gone. I don't know what to do. And the more you dwell on it, it's like you're being sucked down, hopeless. And boy, I mean, so many different times.

[00:13:20] But then looking back on it, you see how God had a hold of you and won't let you sink. Even if you're underwater, he's got this amazing scuba gear because it's a season where, yes, you're under, but he is your lifeline.

[00:13:39] Yeah. Well, David went through a deep discouragement in 1 Samuel chapter 30, looking at the phrases, greatly distressed. The people were grieved. What happened was, it says in verse one, now it happened, David and his men came to Ziklag. Third day, the Amalekites had invaded, taking captive the women who were there, small to great, did not kill anyone, but carried away.

[00:14:09] And went their way. And David and his men came to the city. It was burned with fire. Wives and sons and daughters been taken captive. Then David and the people who were with him lifted up their voices and wept. There was no more power to weep. That's a deep, there's a deep sense of emotion there, especially for men of war.

[00:14:33] And then you have David's two wives. They had been taken captive, which led to David being greatly distressed. The people spoke of stoning him and the people were really grieved. It's an episode in the life of this nation of these grown men, these men of war, where they're brought to their knees.

[00:14:54] And it is, you can look at David, you can look at the men. I mean, we prefer to look at David because he's the one that's going to show us the solution of what to do with discouragement.

[00:15:10] And we have to understand the depth of discouragement, which we may apply the phrase depression to David, because it's not just that he came back to the city and the families were taken captive.

[00:15:22] And it's not just that closest to him who were his partners in life were ready to kill him. It's not just that he's been on the run for 10 years from King Saul. It's that it's on top of all that.

[00:15:37] It came from a place of compromise and, and backsliding really in his life that led to all this. And it all hit him at once in a very real way. And his response to it all was discouragement.

[00:15:52] Which is natural. And I think everyone listening in today needs to understand that your feelings of depression or being discouraged doesn't make you a bad person.

[00:16:02] Doesn't make you a bad Christian. If we knew your story and we were able to sit there with you, we would conclude that it was a normal response to the situations that you're facing.

[00:16:15] And so as we look at David, this mighty man of war, we can't, we can't think of him in a sense where we can't think of him like, well, I can't believe David.

[00:16:26] You're you're you don't have any faith. Uh, you don't know. He had all the faith in the world. He was just in a bad spot in his life.

[00:16:32] And Bob, before the episode, we talked about a few seasons of that in your life and having, having that personality melancholy in my life.

[00:16:41] I've had a few seasons of that, but the greatest one was when my son passed away, uh, in 2013. Uh, and it just completely, uh, halted everything in my life.

[00:16:53] I've never, I've never, I've never sensed I've never before then and since then ever experienced anything like that. Uh, and I, I would hope to never experience it, but it was brutal, um, brutal.

[00:17:06] And every, every level it, it affected my marriage. It affected my kids. It affected my relationship with my grandson. It affected, um, my ministry.

[00:17:17] And it was, it just led to deep, deep discouragement, depression. And I went to the scriptures and read them like I never have before. Um, I clung to the scriptures, even though I wasn't studying for Bible studies right away.

[00:17:31] And I was, I was looking just like you described. It's not just the quicksand because I think if I was, if I used the quicksand, I would have sunk the first day. Uh, cause I don't think there's any way you can fight quicksand.

[00:17:43] You're just toast. Uh, but when you use the illustration of, uh, being underwater, I'm like, oh, I can, I, I hear that because you can fight to get back up.

[00:17:53] You can't breathe. You're gasping and, but you're finding to get back up and you sink and you're finding to get back up and you sink.

[00:17:59] And, and I've definitely, um, experienced that as well. The reality of this is the passage, you know, out of that, um, out of that, you know, the, it was such a difficult time in the life of our church.

[00:18:11] Such a difficult time from the pulpit that, um, you know, I was sad. The church was sad. Uh, everybody was sad. Uh, and in, you know, as sad as the church was, they didn't even know the half of it of what was going on and, and still don't know the half of what's going on.

[00:18:29] That's still ongoing now, 11 years later, um, that make the situation so much more complicated and difficult and hard. And even that phrase might be helpful for you listening because we don't know the half of what you're going through either.

[00:18:43] We don't know how difficult it is. We don't know what family things, what people are doing to you, what they're saying about you, how they're treating you, what, how unfair and unjust.

[00:18:54] I mean it, this world, even in the Christian world or people that say they're Christians can be so brutal and the response of sadness or sorrow or discouragement or being downcast or greatly grieved or crying.

[00:19:10] Like the Psalmist says in another Psalm, you cry where you haven't used, you have no more tears.

[00:19:15] Now, up until my son passed away that I'd never done that, but I know what it's like now, uh, and being able to relate.

[00:19:23] So David became a friend of mine. He is going through it. It's difficult on every level. He has nowhere to turn in his life.

[00:19:33] Nowhere. There is no human solution, which brings us to the solution.

[00:19:39] And you had mentioned it already, Bob, but within the context of David's life and my life, this is what got me out of it.

[00:19:48] Uh, not that I'm not discouraged, uh, still, or, or if it actually really depends on what I place my mind on, right?

[00:19:55] If I, if I, uh, delight myself in the Lord, he'll give me the desires of my heart.

[00:20:00] If, uh, the promise to me and to Bob and to everyone listening is, is that he will keep you in perfect peace.

[00:20:08] Whose mind is stayed on him.

[00:20:10] So if I let my mind wander, if I look at 11 years lost, uh, and every day, if I look at the circumstances, then I'll be greatly discouraged.

[00:20:20] What I need to do is what David does.

[00:20:23] And every time I do this, every time we do this, this is how you got out of that difficulty in Phoenix.

[00:20:29] This is how you got out of the next difficulty.

[00:20:32] And this is how you got out of the next difficulty, Bob.

[00:20:35] Same with me.

[00:20:36] This is how you'll get through it.

[00:20:38] How do I handle these feelings of discouragement?

[00:20:40] I acknowledge them.

[00:20:42] I express them and that I've got to take them to the Lord.

[00:20:46] And that's what David does.

[00:20:48] He's got David's greatly distressed.

[00:20:50] The people spoke of stoning him.

[00:20:52] So you got weeping, crying, wailing, and then we're going to kill you.

[00:20:57] We're going to kill you, David.

[00:20:58] It's all your fault.

[00:21:00] And David's there like, it is my fault.

[00:21:02] I'm a backslider.

[00:21:03] What am I thinking?

[00:21:04] Why did I leave God?

[00:21:06] It is my fault.

[00:21:07] It wasn't completely his fault.

[00:21:09] The Amalekites, the Amalekites are sinners and rebels.

[00:21:14] So it wasn't completely his fault, but it could feel like that.

[00:21:17] That's what makes things worse.

[00:21:18] That's the oppression, right?

[00:21:20] The outside pressures, not just the demonic oppression, but the pressure of the situation.

[00:21:25] The pressure of people's sinful decisions against you.

[00:21:30] So David was like, I know it's all my fault.

[00:21:32] No, it's not all his fault.

[00:21:33] If he ever said that, because the Amalekites are the catalyst to all this.

[00:21:38] But David opened the door through his sin, through his backsliding, through his lack of faith for a moment.

[00:21:45] And it says, he's greatly distressed.

[00:21:46] The people are going to sow him.

[00:21:47] The soul of all the people were grieved.

[00:21:49] Every man for his sons and daughters.

[00:21:53] But, and this happens to be a good one.

[00:21:56] David strengthened himself in the Lord, his God.

[00:21:59] And if you read the rest of the chapter, that changed everything.

[00:22:02] He did.

[00:22:03] Then he called for an ephod to find the will of God.

[00:22:07] Yeah.

[00:22:08] And he was saying, should we even go?

[00:22:10] He didn't know what to do because his feelings were overwhelmed.

[00:22:15] But even when we don't know what to do, when there are no feelings, when we turn to the Lord, he's ready to answer.

[00:22:23] I mean, you have 600 mighty men ready to kill you.

[00:22:26] I mean, that's serious.

[00:22:28] That's their families.

[00:22:29] I mean, it's...

[00:22:30] It's huge.

[00:22:31] Oh yeah, it is.

[00:22:32] You know, Bob, the things that we feel, whether it's 600 men or six men or one man, if the end result is the same.

[00:22:42] Sometimes when I'm sharing my story, because that has become a big part of my ministry now.

[00:22:46] That's the very first book I ever published was a book that after, as the church was going through the grieving process and it was really, really sad.

[00:22:55] I felt the Lord says, Ed, the church is really, really sad.

[00:22:58] You need to let them off the hook.

[00:22:59] Like, you need to let them...

[00:23:01] And I'm like, what do you mean?

[00:23:02] I'm processing that.

[00:23:03] And the way I interpreted that is, it's almost like God was telling me and the church, I'm going to help you turn a corner, but you've got to be the one.

[00:23:12] You've got to be the pastor.

[00:23:13] And what I did was put a series of studies together.

[00:23:16] I didn't know how long it would be, but I began to teach on different people in the Bible, different situations where the Lord showed up deep, you know, whether it was barrenness or...

[00:23:27] And it was whatever the topics were, sorrow, sadness.

[00:23:32] This first Samuel chapter 30 was one of the chapters.

[00:23:36] We looked at Hannah.

[00:23:37] We looked at Rahab, I think.

[00:23:39] It was the book, God's Help for the Troubled Heart.

[00:23:42] And it's not a book on grief.

[00:23:44] It's a book on God's faithfulness and victory through life circumstances when our hearts are all troubled and beat up and discouraged and depressed.

[00:23:54] And really, the book could be summarized in this phrase, but David strengthened himself in the Lord.

[00:24:00] That's the key.

[00:24:01] And we have to be careful here, and we're almost out of time, but it's worth...

[00:24:06] Like, strengthening yourself in the Lord, coming to church, praying, seeking the Lord, doesn't mean you won't feel sad.

[00:24:14] It doesn't...

[00:24:15] We're so quick on, if I do, then this will.

[00:24:20] But that's...

[00:24:21] There's no guarantee this may be part of you.

[00:24:23] Like, to say after 11 years, I'm not sad anymore, that's just silly.

[00:24:27] Of course I am.

[00:24:28] And I can be to the depth of sadness and sorrow as much as I want to...

[00:24:32] If I want to go deep, it would not take very long for me to assess all my circumstances and go, oh man, my life is really messed up.

[00:24:41] I got a lot to be sad.

[00:24:43] And it's true.

[00:24:44] But this habit, this is a new habit, which includes worship music, includes a steady diet of sermons.

[00:24:53] It includes a steady seeking of the Lord.

[00:24:57] It includes a new strengthening Lord.

[00:25:00] One of the ways that I strengthen myself in the Lord is through prayer journaling.

[00:25:03] I've never done that before, but I'll get out my iPad and I've got a file, and I'm just writing out whatever on my heart, which...

[00:25:10] Whenever I pass away and somebody finds that journal, they're going to go, oh my gosh, Ed really was messed up and hurt.

[00:25:18] Absolutely.

[00:25:18] Because I can't...

[00:25:19] Like, listen to him.

[00:25:20] I'm like, I know, but it gets it out so that I can live the rest of the day and gives me a chance to express it before the Lord, pray for it, pray through it.

[00:25:33] So that he...

[00:25:34] And you might have different tools that you can accompany, because that goes with Bible study.

[00:25:38] And there's a book that I want to recommend that's very important.

[00:25:44] The author is Ed Welch, and the title of it is Depression.

[00:25:48] It's the best biblical assessment of this topic, not only of it, but how to get out of it, that I've ever read.

[00:25:57] Very, very good.

[00:25:58] It's called Depression by Ed Welch.

[00:26:00] If this is an area you wrestle with, you can always email me.

[00:26:04] I have a lot of resources on discouragement, depression, and grief.

[00:26:07] They all go together that I could send to you if you email me.

[00:26:10] But any final thoughts, Bob?

[00:26:12] Yeah.

[00:26:13] There are times when, in me, it feels like a big log jam, and I just can't seem to connect with the Lord.

[00:26:22] And it's at those times I've learned that I have to sit down with a pen and several pieces of paper and begin to write out my prayer to the Lord.

[00:26:34] And start off with who he is.

[00:26:37] Start off with what he's done for me.

[00:26:39] Start off with those truths as foundational.

[00:26:43] And then I just tell him exactly how I feel, who has offended me.

[00:26:48] I don't hold back anything.

[00:26:50] I tell it like I feel it, because he already knows.

[00:26:53] But there's something about writing it out, and then it's out there.

[00:26:58] And you look at it, and you go, yeah, that's pretty much where I'm at.

[00:27:03] And then that kind of download, to me, seems to break up the log jam, and the Holy Spirit starts speaking to me about him and me.

[00:27:14] And then I write that down as well.

[00:27:17] And so I don't do that all the time, but there are those seasons when I feel like everything's jammed up.

[00:27:23] And to me, that's cleansing.

[00:27:26] Well, we've come to another end of an episode.

[00:27:29] This could be multi—this could be many days, right?

[00:27:33] Because this is a big part of it.

[00:27:35] But to summarize, I think acknowledging it, praying through it, turning to the Lord, knowing that you're not—it's not all you.

[00:27:46] And it may be tied—this is where good fellowship of the body helps, where leaders in your life—

[00:27:55] You know how we've talked before about, you should be a Paul and be pouring into Timothys,

[00:28:00] but you all should be a Timothy with someone pouring into you, where you get the kind of help that you need from a trusted pastor or elder or friend.

[00:28:08] And we can just talk it out with an open Bible.

[00:28:11] But acknowledge it, confess it, come back to the Lord, strengthen yourself.

[00:28:16] Or another translation says, encourage him.

[00:28:19] He encouraged himself in the Lord.

[00:28:22] But it really is a key.

[00:28:25] You're not a bad Christian because you wrestle with it.

[00:28:27] It could be emotional.

[00:28:29] It could be circumstantial.

[00:28:31] It could be medical, mental.

[00:28:34] None of those really matter.

[00:28:36] It's just what you're feeling.

[00:28:37] And with those feelings, you need to take them to the Lord.

[00:28:40] And to think that maybe you'll never have sadness again, that's probably not reality.

[00:28:45] I like to put things in these categories, Bob.

[00:28:47] It's a possibility, but it's probably not a probability.

[00:28:52] And we'll pray about it.

[00:28:54] But you may be sad.

[00:28:55] You may continue to be sad, depending on what day it is.

[00:28:57] But you're going to have to learn how to live and move forward and trust in the Lord more and more.

[00:29:02] And it's going to make you a better person.

[00:29:05] We're going to talk in our next episode about challenges.

[00:29:08] And these are all challenges, aren't they?

[00:29:10] Like, this whole season is built upon itself.

[00:29:13] And we're going to learn how to live with challenges.

[00:29:15] And what God is really doing in the challenges, in the storms of life, how to respond to that.

[00:29:23] And yet, at the same time, the sorrow and sadness just makes you feel like you want to give up.

[00:29:28] You want to quit.

[00:29:29] You want to stay in bed.

[00:29:30] You want to put the covers over your head.

[00:29:32] You don't want to go out.

[00:29:33] You don't want to.

[00:29:33] And that's not God's will for you.

[00:29:35] God wants to heal you, strengthen you, bring you back into fellowship with others,

[00:29:40] bring you back to a place of freedom from that.

[00:29:43] And at the same time, not creating a new identity.

[00:29:47] You don't have a new identity.

[00:29:49] You're not depressed Ed or sad Ed.

[00:29:53] You are just Ed with a walk with the Lord that's going through a season of difficulty.

[00:29:59] And this season might last.

[00:30:01] It will last till I meet Jesus face to face.

[00:30:04] It will, no doubt.

[00:30:05] But even in the seasons, we were explaining to a young man who just moved here to Colorado

[00:30:10] where the weather changes so quickly here.

[00:30:12] Or you can experience all four seasons in one day.

[00:30:15] And life can be like that.

[00:30:17] Like things change so quickly where I might wake up discouraged, but then the Lord encourages me

[00:30:21] and I got a great day.

[00:30:22] Or I wake up really great and then I get into my head and I have a season, a moment of discouragement.

[00:30:28] But I'm living proof, Pastor Bob is living proof, and so many others are, that you can live with difficulties

[00:30:37] and you can live with discouragement and you can take it to the Lord.

[00:30:42] Paul is like you shared.

[00:30:43] I've got David, you've got Paul.

[00:30:45] I've got Paul, you've got David.

[00:30:47] Bob, they live with difficulties and pressed on and move forward, which will be the topic of our next episode.

[00:30:53] So thanks for being here again, Bob.

[00:30:56] Yep, absolutely.

[00:30:57] You're listening to the Lead to Serve podcast.

[00:30:59] We're coming to a close today.

[00:31:00] Be sure to leave a review.

[00:31:02] It always helps.

[00:31:03] Give us some feedback.

[00:31:04] You can email us.

[00:31:05] You can text us, 720-608-0012.

[00:31:11] That's a texting number.

[00:31:12] You can also leave a voicemail there.

[00:31:13] It doesn't get answered very often, but the texts do and the voicemails do.

[00:31:17] We'd love to hear from you.

[00:31:19] If you have ideas, maybe you need some help in discouragement.

[00:31:24] We certainly, I would say at the very end, if you are suicidal, if it's that bad, please don't do it.

[00:31:32] Ask for help.

[00:31:33] It's just that season where it's deep, deep dark right now, but you will get out of it.

[00:31:39] God is ready to encourage you and ask for help.

[00:31:43] I know the Lord will use it, and I know that God has help for you.

[00:31:48] Reach out.

[00:31:49] You can always call 911 if it's urgent, if there's an urgency about it, but you can ask for a friend.

[00:31:58] And again, the Lord will get you through this.

[00:32:01] It's dark, but the light is shining.

[00:32:04] The Holy Spirit's with you.

[00:32:05] I know He can help you.

[00:32:06] Give us some feedback.

[00:32:08] We'll be back next time on our next topic.

[00:32:11] It's been a great season so far.

[00:32:13] We're so glad that you've stuck with us.

[00:32:15] The Lord bless you, encourage you, and strengthen you.

[00:32:19] Thank you for joining us for this episode of Lead to Serve with Pastor Ed Taylor,

[00:32:23] a leadership podcast from Calvary Church in Aurora, Colorado.

[00:32:26] If you have a leadership question you want to hear answered on a future Lead to Serve podcast,

[00:32:31] please email it to pastored at calvaryco.church.

[00:32:34] And if you like our podcast, please subscribe, rate, or review us on iTunes,

[00:32:39] and share us with your friends on social media.

[00:32:41] Thanks again for joining us, and we'll see you next time right here on the Lead to Serve podcast.