"War Against Spiritual Darkness" w/ Eddie Penney

[00:00:05] Hey and welcome to Basecamp. This is a podcast from all things, all people, in our ministry exists to explore the darkest places and world views, to equip Christians to engage them with the gospel. Most episodes of Basecamp podcast include me answering or addressing

[00:00:22] a topic or question, but from time to time we want to feature people who you can learn from and people whose experiences might be different than yours, but whoever it is, if they're on this show, they're involved in going into the darkest places and reaching

[00:00:37] the people for this from God. And today's guest is an amazing example of that. It's former Navy SEAL Eddie Penney. You're going to hear me give his extensive intro here in a few minutes, but Eddie is a former Navy SEAL, specifically served on SEAL Team

[00:00:53] 6. Before he joined the Navy, he was in the Marine Corps because you know, one of the hardest branches of the US military is just not enough. You got to have two. And so Eddie's

[00:01:02] an amazing guy, but what makes him most amazing is not just his history of being a war fighter, being one of the maneless men on the face of the planet, but honestly it's his walk with Christ,

[00:01:15] which as you're going to hear is about as unlikely of a testimony as humanly possible. And he and his wife now are leading an amazing ministry called on a freight, which is actually

[00:01:27] the same title of a book that he wrote and they're doing tremendous work. And you are absolutely going to love hearing from Eddie. But first I want to invite you to go and sign up for the

[00:01:39] exploration society journal. This is the newsletter community for the exploration society, which is the ATAP community devoted to bringing the gospel to the darkest and most difficult places. This twice monthly newsletter includes notes from me, articles that I've written and other people

[00:01:59] have written info on coming podcast, guests, merch and live events which we have one in October. And so I can't wait in the newsletter. I can't wait to tell you in the society journal in

[00:02:10] a couple of weeks who's going to be the speaker at that live event and for sitting with Carolina, you're going to love it. But those live events include the hopeful planting of exploration

[00:02:20] society chapters all over the country. And so hopefully there might be one in your area in the next couple of years. Maybe even you would be part of planting and leading that exploration society chapter filled with people who are devoted to reaching the darkest and most difficult places

[00:02:34] in your area, the places that are furthest from God. And so I'm excited. Go check that out. Go join that newsletter community in for the next two weeks from the publishing of this podcast.

[00:02:46] Anybody who signs up or has signed up for the society journal in two weeks is going to be entered into a drawing for the complete package of our 2023 merch which includes an exploration society hat, which is moisture wicking I'm wearing it right now.

[00:03:02] If I'm hiking, if I'm golfing or if I'm standing in like a new age or a cold coffee shop, share in the gospel with somebody and I'm sweating, it's the perfect hat to wear. And it has

[00:03:13] the exploration society logo and branding on there, along with that exploration society, mugs are available. An exploration society sticker all of that is available any time through making a one-time donation to all things all people. But like I said right now, if you sign up

[00:03:29] for this society journal, you're automatically entered to win the entire merch package from a tap, exploration society. And so go check that out. The link for that's in the bio of this episode.

[00:03:40] But the reason you came and the reason why I'm excited for you to hear isn't really much to do with me. It's everything to do with our guests today, Eddie Penny. So let's go to him.

[00:04:01] My guest on this episode spent 20 years in the US military first as a marine and later as a Navy seal assigned to the Naval Special Warfare Development Group, Dev Group, better known

[00:04:12] as Seal Team 6. After watching the events of 9-11 unfold from Buds, which is the basic seal training course he went on to two deployments with Seal Team 2 before being selected for the elite Seal Team 6, where he went on five more deployments to Iraq, Afghanistan and Africa. Fighting alongside

[00:04:31] some of the greatest warriors histories ever known, Eddie served as a breacher, often the first person at the front of the line who's responsibility it is to pick a lock or blow up a door

[00:04:41] to get into a target. After many experiences of seeing God working his life and chalking it up to coincidence every time, he had his life changed while attending a simple men's retreat,

[00:04:52] where he spoke to God for the first time. His life was further changed when he met his now-wife Amanda and he is now the CEO of contingent group, a company he founded in leader of unafraid

[00:05:05] where he hosts the unafraid podcast, it is the author of unafraid staring down terror as a Navy seal and single that all of that and more to help people find their unafraid mindset. He's a marine

[00:05:17] seal, a husband, a father but most importantly a devoted follower of Christ. It's my honor to have Eddie Penny on the show. Eddie, thank you for making time for this. This is incredible.

[00:05:30] Thanks for having me on. I was quite an introduction and I appreciate the kind of words. Thank you. Yeah, well and they're easy to say for somebody who's who's who's have quite the resume like you.

[00:05:40] You know, I want to say too for listeners obviously this is going to come out a few weeks after it's not lost on me. You know, Eddie Unite or given to have this conversation on Memorial Day in the United States of all days

[00:05:52] and I know that you wouldn't want me to thank you but so much of your story and people can listen to multiple iterations of your story on other podcasts that I'll reference throughout this conversation

[00:06:03] but a huge part of your story is grief and loss and watching so many brothers that you served with tragically lose their life as seals and so I just want to thank you for making time today.

[00:06:16] It would have been easy to just say, hey, let's not do this today but yeah, so I told you pre-show that the way that I discovered Eddie Penny. My friends and I we listen to

[00:06:29] all the things that I think a lot of American men are fascinated with the Jaco Willings, the the motivational stuff but we're all the levers and so we'd always kind of been bummed that none of

[00:06:40] those guys are speaking from at least as far as we can tell from a Christian mindset like hey, you know yeah it's important to wake up early in the morning but there's things more important than

[00:06:49] that there's there's things more important than just working hard. In my buddy Steven we're in the car we were actually going to do some crazy ataps stuff and he said dude you got to listen to the Sean Ryan show

[00:07:01] and I'd been a Sean Ryan fan for a while and he said dude there's this guy Eddie Penny on there and he started telling me your story and what he told me about you which is what kind of

[00:07:11] perk my ears made me go listen to you is my buddy Steven and my other friend JR they said that you talked to non-Christians like you're talking to a Christian and that you don't apologize explain your

[00:07:22] faith and what he meant by that was like sometimes Christians when we're talking about our faith we we're like yeah and I believe the Bible but here's why I believe the Bible and

[00:07:33] I know it kind of sounds crazy but like they said that when you were talking to Sean that you just like man you just said it you just said what you believe you said what you know

[00:07:41] and the first thing there's like 10 minutes in Sean who you'd served with a long time ago on Siltain too I think said dude you don't cost as much anymore and you said you know basically

[00:07:53] chalked it up to you like yeah I'm just I'm just trying to live my life glorifying Christ and in that moment like Sean was like whoa you know and you know I've I've listened to that episode

[00:08:05] I was blown away I think it's evidence the impact of that now people who fall a Sean on on social media know that he's at least curious about Christianity now it seems like he's exploring it which is

[00:08:15] amazing so he's credited you largely with that but I listen to that episode I was blown away at any I've spoken to scholars I've spoken to pastors writers theologians you share and explain

[00:08:29] your faith in a way that I've never heard anybody do so before we talk about anything else when you are in those situations whether it's a podcast interview or talking to another brother who you served with when you're talking about your faith the people who don't share it

[00:08:44] what is it that's going through your mind that enables you to talk in a way that blows away you know people who've been Christians their entire life who are still struggling to not

[00:08:52] apologize explain their faith to people yeah it's a good question I guess you you say and there's I never really realized or I guess thought of I guess I explained my faith in a

[00:09:04] specific way I just talk about it like based off of the experience that I've had the eat yeah he saved my life I mean what do you what would you do if you're about to walk out on the middle of

[00:09:14] the street and all of a sudden someone just pulls you by the collar backs he would get hit by you know a truck that's going by what would you how would you look at those people that person

[00:09:24] that just pulled you back you would be even doing anything that won't for them you'd be like what can I do for you and I believe I don't believe I know that that's what the Lord did

[00:09:34] and he does it in such a unique way and you know it's like well why do you let me go through this we always we always ask why why why and to be quite honest with you we don't need to know all the

[00:09:48] wise and another reason for those wise and I've learned is just like you know my seal training as I had to go through certain things to level up to get stronger to go through the

[00:10:00] trials as it talks about James won and when you realize that and he shows you like we're kind of reveals what your past is it's like oh my gosh I have been just blinded and of course I

[00:10:13] comes in from the world of flesh and the enemy but once you see that it's like I remember and I still do it I'm like I'm so sorry that I didn't see this but but he knows it's not like

[00:10:24] he's oh well thanks for a pa like he knows and just seeing the beautiful it's just like hey I wonder I want to if I found something like the most nutritious food this will never make you blow

[00:10:35] it's gonna give you all the energy it's healthy for you I would want to share it with the world I'd want them to feel exactly and that's it that's how I look at Christ is like

[00:10:45] this is it all the trauma the PTSD the TBI the the losses that I've suffered anything man made it could have been a definitely was a bandaid alcohol was a bandaid women were a bandaid pills were a bandaid anything and everything to keep my mind off of

[00:11:06] sitting in my crap in the moment was just a bandaid with him he's in that crap with me he's like let's go you got this it's time for you to go to boy to man and I finally learned that

[00:11:18] is like wait a second this what what why why why am I going through this is like hey what are you trying to show me what is the lesson in this and then he just he just starts putting that

[00:11:30] armor on you and we just start walking in that warrior faith and it is it and it is the most beautiful thing I heard something so profound this past weekend which I've heard before

[00:11:40] it really stuck out is the Lord is all about making your mess the message is the stuff that we have gone through that we've endured that we're like we can never be used I'm disqualified that is

[00:11:52] the biggest life from the depths of L ever that is not true every one of us is unique and a special way and if you think otherwise I just want you to know right now you're believing the lies

[00:12:05] of the enemy and that's just not who we're called to be yeah yeah and I'll tell you man in you know sometimes the Lord works in funny ways that I'd like to think that you know you know

[00:12:16] this about yourself but you just you know you're you're going after it so hard but on the outside looking in like it is unfortunate that what you have in the way that you look at your

[00:12:27] faith is is unfortunately really rare in at least our part of the world where Christians are so comfortable but we're also like we're very worried about offending people you know we're very worried about our faith offending people in you know for listeners understand that the Sean Ryan show

[00:12:45] isn't necessarily a Christian podcast not yet at least but but people need to go listen to that and it's in my opinion and I'm not just you know blowing slow up your rear end I'm just saying like

[00:12:56] it's a good example of how to talk to an unbeliever with an attitude that I think is missing from our part of the world and in kind of the church that you and I are running in which is

[00:13:06] hey I want to be bold for my faith but I don't want to make anybody feel bad or I don't want to make anybody feel like I'm better than them and it's like you did a great job and I've

[00:13:14] heard you do it multiple times now of yeah okay I am gonna offend some people like Jesus is offensive but it's a good offensive it's a good thing to be offended by and so with that I you know

[00:13:32] in listening to you talk and not even just you like other guys who had served especially like spec ops guys I hear I've heard you say it and I've heard other guys say this idea of like hey when

[00:13:45] I was home after a deployment and this is a big struggle for you at least at first you know working your way through marriages and being a father was that you really just wanted to get back over to with your brothers in deployment and in fighting and obviously

[00:14:02] the part that that played in your story wasn't always positive but so much of what we do at A-TAP is equipping people for spiritual fight and I know unafraid as well as the idea of like hey

[00:14:12] there's a fight to be fought there's a war to be warred but it seems to me that that believers don't often have that same appetite as you and your so-com brothers and so as someone who was a

[00:14:24] war fighter before you were a believer what you was your reaction to coming into the faith and hearing about this cosmic battle between good and evil and seeing the lines drawn between

[00:14:36] the evil you had seen with your own eyes and things like spiritual warfare but then seeing how how Christians were responding to it and really maybe more were like it was a lack there of a

[00:14:45] responding to it was there some dissonance there of like wait guys I'm a war fighter I can tell you we're not doing this right honestly to be the first word that you wait we just said was blind the

[00:14:57] blind the blind that's all I just heard and I mean two Corinthians four four says the god of this war which is Satan has blinded the minds of unbelievers from seeing the glory of the gospel of Christ

[00:15:08] and he has I was in that category and and that was really the one thing that intrigued me to the most of this to them what we would call Christianity was the spiritual warfare piece

[00:15:22] I didn't understand it for the longest time I mean I really understand it now and still learning more of it because there's a lot to a lot to the warfare which is just it's it's pretty intense yeah

[00:15:37] but I guess my drive of the whole unafraid thing and just me being here to speak on Christ there to glorify Christ is the fact that so many so-called Christians or would call them

[00:15:50] self-Christians are walking around in a fall they don't even know that there's a war going around them and they were just played they are manipulated and they have no idea that's going on and some

[00:16:00] choose not to they take the plausible die a deniability route which many of us I know I fall another quarter category as well but that is just not the way to go you've got to stand up you've

[00:16:12] got to fight and it's not doesn't mean that you've got to you know sacrifice your wealth says I true you do need to sacrifice your life but the thing is the the Lord is with you in

[00:16:24] in these tons of trials we are not called to be afraid but to fear not and walk walk with him he's right there next to us and in his authority we can take out this oppression that is over all of us

[00:16:35] and I really understood that oppression is you know you come back and anytime I'd have a serious conversation with my spouse or dealing with children or somebody at work I'm like why am I

[00:16:47] all of a sudden I am going to I want to punch I want to scream I want to yell I want to turn and run I can't stay in the moment now now that everything's spiritual we got emotional we got physical

[00:16:59] we got spiritual but spiritual component is so huge and I realized that everything especially with the VA was you know push this pill push that pill push this pill and a lot of it is spiritual

[00:17:10] I mean when I say a lot I mean a lot and it takes me off because hit we're in this weird we act like in this war we act like nothing's going on it's like hey Eddie go on this battlefield

[00:17:21] here take this bag of candy and go hand it out to people in the leave you alone that's no I need to weapon that takes him out and I believe the church when I say the church that we are the church

[00:17:31] right the people the church and majority are not doing that the physical church and the church that you know fills those physical places are not doing it it's all about your feelings how do you feel

[00:17:43] today I want to address I want to give you that mindset good feeling and send you back out for another week and I'll see you next week and that is not true we're not equipping we need to equip the men

[00:17:53] and the women and our children to go fight this oppression and until that happens we will continue and I believe we are going to continue down this destruction around that we see you know some

[00:18:05] prevalent in our country yeah and I've heard you say like that a lot of it that what you see is good good people keeping in their mouth shut but it doesn't work it doesn't work and it's kind of the

[00:18:17] old saying of you know all it takes for evil to try up is good for good men to say nothing but you know it's interesting to me is that people who aren't Christian like the least Christian people

[00:18:28] like we've mentioned you know like some of the shows that you've been on and some of the people you know it's it's crazy to me that evangelical Christians are finding more allies in the non

[00:18:38] Christian world because even people like Sean you know up until he had that conversation with you his his shows blown up now because he's featuring people who are really saying a lot of the same

[00:18:50] stuff as we are but they're not attributing it to spiritual they're just saying hey like you know the western world the United States is falling apart because evil is triumphant like so as a Christian now and you're in so many spheres where you know you're around non-Christian so

[00:19:07] so much I think especially the guys who used to serve with and those types of circles like you know what are you communicating to people as as the people who are not Christian who don't have you know the Bible as their you know their authority in their life

[00:19:21] who they're going hey Eddie actually I do agree with you it seems like the world is falling apart it seems like there is such a thing as evil how are you approaching those those conversations with

[00:19:30] people now well I mean the proof is what you for unbelievers they just see it right they just see it okay I give you exhibit America that's what it looks like when you take God out of schools when you take

[00:19:44] out of hospitals when you take God out of certain things this is what you get this is this will only get worse until God gets put back in so it's kind of it's kind of easy it's like hey guys

[00:19:56] do you see what's going on yeah it's getting easier you know why what's the one thing that's missing okay and that's you know it's not it's not the money it's not gadgets it's not whatever

[00:20:08] or any kind of perversion that's all there but we're taking out God it's so it's obvious this is what you get and it's kind of funny you said that about you know non Christians are non believers

[00:20:20] is I remember you know we you know we got used to do a lot of private shooting and you'd always want to get the person that never shot because you get you get to instill the correct way to all

[00:20:31] the fundamentals of firearms it's a lot it's much easier and better than some of that you know went and shot with our uncle for decades right and then they come they're like they have to

[00:20:41] read you have to retrain them, re-figure it that's where I see we call non-believers is like okay oh my gosh so this makes so much sense it makes so much sense because it's the truth

[00:20:53] let me just talk about the truth don't fabricate it don't try to bring some fluff to it's like hey hey I didn't make the rules this is what we got but I started doing this this is it the fruit

[00:21:05] right our evidence we're known by our fruit yeah and it's very true I mean watch out for false problems because there's tons of them but I mean if you see someone's life like how will they get

[00:21:15] healed it wasn't psychedelics I did it for me it wasn't going to the shaman in the Amazon it was opening the Bible calling on his name and him showing up and I'm like oh my gosh

[00:21:27] I have really been missing some stuff and now I'm like man I really wish I had this you know decades ago I would have been so much stronger so much healthier my families would have not crumbled

[00:21:39] my I don't wouldn't have to go back and repair with my children which I can now with the Lord but I would never be in that situation we don't we we and what they did all the time is like

[00:21:50] can't do this can't do that law you know all that stuff but the Lord is just trying to protect us just like we want to protect our children don't touch that stove why I don't want you to burn your hand

[00:22:03] look both ways before you cross the road why because I don't want to mat truck to take you out yeah that's the Lord obviously on a bigger scale but that's that's that's the Lord

[00:22:14] he cares yeah I think that man like what you just shared it's like I can see that imagery of the shooting range and if I think that's a large part of like maybe what I see in you and you know

[00:22:27] I became a Christian when I was a freshman high school so it's like not early not late you know to mean but I think part of the reason why I see something unique in you is you do like of course

[00:22:36] we would all we want our children to grow up and church we want our children to grow up knowing the Lord from an early age but there is a special blessing for people like you who who lived life

[00:22:46] before they met Christ and so it it made sense it wasn't like this kind of like business usual type faith it was like oh no this is actually oh man this saved my life you know you understand that

[00:22:59] I've heard you I've heard you talk about this idea of warrior peace and I don't know if that's like a doctor and you know that you talk about all the time but you've said it a couple times and the

[00:23:07] things that I listened to and get ready to have the opportunity to talk to you and I'm fascinated by that what do you mean when you say warrior peace and is there something you think Christ

[00:23:18] follower specifically can learn from it? Absolutely and that whole thing came up I remember I remember what what kept me away from Jesus was that I viewed him as a guy wearing robes

[00:23:36] sitting under a nice tree and shade petting a lamb yeah I was like there's nothing in me that wants to follow that yeah that was not a man and and Jesus didn't paint that picture the church

[00:23:51] man painted that picture and and and Jesus is love he is compassion and that is first and foremost that is that is I think we would all agree we would love to be in peace and loving and not have any

[00:24:04] strife with anyone more than conflict I think we could probably all agree on that maybe besides some demonic oppressed people but but there's another side of that Jesus is not a pushover he's

[00:24:19] a fierce and he is a warrior I mean he says I've come to turn people like mother against daughter son against father like that that that stuff like that is that I mean that's what why we have

[00:24:34] what we have but he he's he stands in the gap and he's like I got this whatever it is I have it and I and I saw that being missed in in the whole Christian faith I'm like why are we what are we

[00:24:49] talking about like thaw hugging it out the loving turn your cheek the mercy the grace all the which are important and we should that should be the pedic like but we're missing we're missing a big part of

[00:25:01] the intelligence here it's like Eddie I need you to go take down this compound it's got 15 foot walls and they don't tell me anything about what's inside I get there at all the sudden there's

[00:25:14] 100 fighters I need that intel I need to know about spirit of darkness I need to know that there's an enemy what can they do what does it look like and how can the Lord use it then the authority the Lord

[00:25:24] how do I take that out that gives me the warrior instead of like getting an argument with my wife and going turn into the internet I stand in the storm with Christ and I face it they guys I know

[00:25:37] if I go do some things now I just open the door people think like oh you just did that no but they don't understand as you open a door for darkness to come in and torment you and your family no one

[00:25:48] talks about the spirit of darkness they don't talk about the things called demons which are still real evil spirits unclean spirit sick of the same thing they don't talk about that and they wonder

[00:26:00] why can I not stop going to the internet why do I keep cheating on my wife why can I not put this bottle down why why why they're searching for all these healing and they don't realize

[00:26:11] they got demonic activity I'm making get rid of that in the name of Jesus by getting to the root of the problem which the Holy Spirit will show you and that is a beautiful thing is like that

[00:26:21] is a warrior that like he is he is the greatest mentor leader ever ever ever ever there's no one even come close yeah yeah with a capital H yeah I tell people it's like one of the highest Christian

[00:26:42] ideals and you mentioned them right mercy and turn the other cheek but the one I tell people all time is you know hey you know Christ says love your enemies pray for those who persecute you but to be

[00:26:51] able to do that you do have to understand you have enemies yes you do have to understand that we are facing an opposition and it's it is interesting how and I understand why it's gotten this way but

[00:27:02] it is interesting and people might even listen to you and me talk about this and be like these guys they're they're wanting to turn it into something that's not but it's in my opinion it's actually

[00:27:10] not bad it's that the church in the West for like the last 20 30 40 years has focused so heavily on great things good things but they haven't been focusing on the whole message which is

[00:27:23] we are we are able to turn our cheek and extend mercy and love our neighbor because we know what the truth of reality is and no one else does and and so it's it's it's it's interesting like hearing

[00:27:36] so much of your experience about spiritual battle be informed by a life of physical battle you know and and then to just the personal experiences you've had I am fascinated I love

[00:27:50] listening to guys like you talk to each other because I'm not one I wish me and my friends we wish we had been but we learn it from you guys and I love when I listen to team guys talk to each

[00:28:01] other and they talk about deployments and one of the first questions they ask each others what was your up tempo like and I think that's operations tempo I imagine and so for listeners it's like

[00:28:11] basically how often were you going out on direct actions how often were you going out and and it's almost like funny to me because sometimes I hear it and it's almost maybe a way of like

[00:28:21] team guys and and spec ops guys to compare like how much were you actually doing things like that but but it's an important question it seems because it talks about how often were you going out

[00:28:31] how often were you going out and getting into it and I actually think that that's a principle that Christians can learn from because we shouldn't be sitting around in waiting as Christians for opportunities to share our faith for opportunities to have hard discussions I think we should

[00:28:51] be going out and looking for it almost like how you guys looked at direct actions or at least moving towards it when we see it show up in front of us is with with with our children if it's with

[00:29:01] our spouse if it's somebody at work if it's somebody at church if it's the the gas station clerk like the reason why ATEP we are battle cries into the dark is it's like hey when you see it

[00:29:11] you need to be the one to go and almost treat it like how you guys talk about direct actions so as you continually speak to more believers with with your unafraid platform I know that this

[00:29:22] year you started speaking at churches and things like that and if there's a pastor listening bring in aty penny which is which is so weird I'm like we were going to our first church

[00:29:30] I like to hear about life I'm like we are going into a church to talk about the Lord this is very very deep and totally unexpected oh my gosh yeah and I think it's people like you

[00:29:49] you have a message that Christians need to hear and I'll say that until I'm blue in the face but so so you know as you continually get those more opportunities what are the and I don't

[00:29:59] want to make this about eddy penny the navy seal because you actually have so much more to offer than just your military. Yeah that is that is so funny that was my identity forever yeah now

[00:30:08] I look back I'm like a kid I was an awesome job and I'm going to take what I've learned in the flesh and the war and literally move it over to spare war because that this war's way harder it's way

[00:30:20] this will take you out of the kingdom yeah and it's almost like I see us all sitting at a table and we all bring something to the table you know yeah yeah exactly and you know for me

[00:30:30] it's like I want to get a table full of men who understand what we're talking about and it's like you know it's almost like there are some of us who bring kind of like what an intelligence officer

[00:30:40] would bring hey this is what the enemy's doing this is this and this and then you have the warfighters you have the guys that are like you know just there's something about them you know that

[00:30:48] that is just like they can't be stopped and so yeah I don't want to make it about hey eddy was a seal and seals are better than not seals but you do bring something interesting to the table

[00:30:59] so what is it about your time in the teams that like when you get up in front of a church or you're just talking to people like this that you're like hey if I could get Christians

[00:31:09] to to hear this one thing that my buds instructor said or this one thing that a team leader said or this one thing that I learned when I was going out on on DAs or something like that

[00:31:19] what's like the one or two things that you're like I really really would love for the church to understand this the what what I get up in front of people first off I have like that is the one

[00:31:31] that is one place where I become alive it is like in I mean it is awesome it is awesome I always sat on the book like I there's a chapter called their kill at it I couldn't stop killing

[00:31:43] like it was just a greatest feeling and then when I would talk about Christ and just see the joy come on people's faces like they get out of their bondage that was the one thing

[00:31:53] that beat the destroying people was just sharing the word and people the light bulb go the light bulb going off and they see oh my gosh I don't have to be slave to this I'm not

[00:32:04] I'm not not so or something I'm being held down or oppressed it's like yeah man this is this that we can get through it but one thing that I see continuously and it breaks my heart it

[00:32:15] really does is I see and it's more on the it's both men and women but you know men are supposed to be the spiritual leader men are supposed to rise and the enemy is attacks men um hard they attack

[00:32:32] women to get to the men I believe because if you take out the man you take out generations you're taking out the children that are being I mean that's like look at fatherless homes

[00:32:41] I mean look at inner cities that's in this great example of them but it takes it out and now you've got boys and girls being raised usually by their mothers and they don't have a male

[00:32:54] leader figure to to feed into them and so you know then and then that opens the gateway for darkness to come in and give them a whole new identity that could be from a homeless sexual spirit

[00:33:06] that could be from something that's like hey you are this or someone just gives them a bad word and now they believe that they're a loser for the rest of their life but I see on the faces

[00:33:17] just potential that is waiting to be unlocked and they don't understand it is there because the enemy is holding it back from them it's just suppressing it do not let them know what they can do because of each individual sitting in those seats new what they could do

[00:33:35] their whole generations would change their household would change their work would change the way they talk the way they breathe the way they communicate with others the way they live

[00:33:48] would change they would live a lot of us are not living I know for the longest time I was not living I was held in bondage by either drinking by pill popping by women by anything that would

[00:34:01] give me out of the reality of dealing with my feelings and emotions of what was going on because I was spiritually oppressed and I didn't understand with that spiritually oppressed that there is literally spirits keeping you in the give you thoughts look because a lot of the thoughts

[00:34:16] that we have are not our thoughts they'll give you the thoughts yeah you are this you are like for me you are an ABC that's who you are you're in and that is not true that was a job I was

[00:34:25] I am I am sort of God that's not decent but ace out of God that's who I am and I'm going to act to court and then point you glorify my father like that's what I'm going to do and I

[00:34:35] asked the Lord for that I'm like hey make make your your pet or your purpose for me my passion I pray that over and over like I'm like I don't know what to do here on this thing we call earth

[00:34:47] like what do you want from me please give it to me and just make me love it to make me just go get it and when I finally walked into that it was the first time I really had peace it was the first

[00:35:01] time I had a true mission it was the first time I could see things clear before I was like conforming to the world this seems like we do I'll fall the cow in front of me and that's not

[00:35:14] how we're that's not what we're called to do and if you just look around that's exactly what's happening in it's sad and I and I and I wish I could I went to I did a I did a talk at

[00:35:26] Arkansas not too long ago and that was like if I could just split your heads open and streaming your brains so you could understand what I tried to tell you it was just you would get

[00:35:35] it and they were looking like I maybe that wasn't the best way to say it I was like just like guys yeah I promise you we are blinded the enemy is that good there is an enemy and if you

[00:35:45] go through a certain thing called confession repentance of forgiveness those things break off and then now I just say those words like oh religion religion and that's the enemy giving you

[00:35:54] those thoughts yeah it's good he is good they are to be expected well he's been doing it for thousands of thousands of years yes I mean and and so I think to a listener

[00:36:09] who's hearing you and they've heard you allude to your past I'll start up by saying go listen to I think it's I mean the episode is like four hours long so it's an investment but that the

[00:36:21] interview you do with Sean episode 43 I believe okay yeah go for listeners who want the entire thing they they need to go listen to I'm not gonna make you repeat it I think you repeat it all the time

[00:36:31] but it's a tremendous story but somebody who's listening they go good Lord how did this guy get to this point he's referenced you know all these things that he struggled with you have this

[00:36:43] insane lifelong story of interacting with the Lord and and you you know when you tell it I've heard you tell it a couple different times and you always say oh and then this happened but

[00:36:53] I just chalked it up to coincidence yeah a lot of things you know you know all of that but it started it started with something that was by no means a coincidence and it's this amazing story of

[00:37:04] you being in bed as a child and just seeing you actually you say I saw Jesus in my bedroom yeah I'm front of me yeah I actually went and got I went to I get disciple by a gentleman

[00:37:17] Dr. Edlamance that's he goes through you know he's not a psychiatrist or something but he gets the unclean spirits all few he pulls him out he might go on to the route by our agreement certain

[00:37:28] strongholds things we've done things places we've been who who walks like his sessions are like eight hours they're not like an hour so they're they're like they're intense whether is oftentimes physical manifestations of them you know being you know being delivered right

[00:37:46] and I told him that story you go see us that was a false Jesus and I go really he gets yeah he's like they'll do that he's especially around seven years old they'll do that and he's like they

[00:37:57] worked and was to keep you away from the church because if you look at when any time like usually when you know when Jesus appears or an angel appears is first thing they say is fear not do not

[00:38:06] be afraid and then they go into their mess that's someone just stared stared and stared and I was scared I was so scared for the longest time enough to keep me out of church for decades yeah

[00:38:17] enough to where I would sleep under the covers until I was a sophomore in high school it's embarrassing to say but it's true well it's understandable is what it is you you you you share that story and

[00:38:28] yeah I mean as a result you talk about even on into late adulthood you know up until maybe what a decade ago or so what age did you come to Christ? I think I was 32 I believe okay

[00:38:42] yeah so little over 10 years ago okay so yeah up until just then you know you were you actually describe until you're sure like I was afraid of Jesus like I was afraid of him and the darkness

[00:38:53] that I felt in the room after he he left and and you know now yeah coming to realize that maybe there were some falsehoods to that yes it's not it's not Jesus you said the word yeah it was

[00:39:03] the darkness yeah that's exactly they took they were in that that is my love a lot of my fuel too is like dude because if they're going to me they're going to to other brothers and sisters

[00:39:15] and that's what that's I want people to hear everything you say but when I was listening and researching and every read and everything you have out there and it was just like I was listening

[00:39:28] to you talk about being on I think it was I don't know if you were on Team 6 or Team 2 at this point but you had a friend named Adam who you said made you Christ curious with his faith

[00:39:39] and you use that term all the time which I'm gonna start using I'm gonna credit you every time I do but you don't make it yours but it's curious like what is that like what do you say

[00:39:50] but it's perfect because it's like he made me Christ curious and you know what what was it about Adam specifically there as you began your seal career that made somebody who was kind of like

[00:40:01] dude I'm afraid of Jesus and I'm not I slept under the covers but like this this guy that you served with he made you kind of like perk up and go tell me more about that what was it about Adam

[00:40:12] it was Adam and there was a couple other guys they all went to church together and I remember just them going to church together on Sunday as I do that's like our day off and you're going to church

[00:40:20] and I didn't understand I didn't understand I didn't understand church I didn't I didn't get at all I didn't have the information I didn't have the intel but there was just there was just like

[00:40:28] little differences about them and I couldn't even tell you what they just yeah there was just difference and I think it was the lower bit like you see like and there were just differences

[00:40:41] in that culture which that culture does not breed Christianity yeah it does yet I mean you're surrounded by death murder blood guts sweat and tears it's just not a you know stuff the emotions don't

[00:40:58] feel carry on mission you know there isn't the cross isn't a focal point could it be absolutely well they'd be better absolutely but I didn't you know obviously I was so like I said to Krithi

[00:41:11] is four four I was blinded I mean I had the scales on my eyes and I didn't in that in care I was I was so focused on the devil used the the dangle and the character from my face about call and women

[00:41:22] I mean that kept me away from him anything and everything and then go to her and shoot back man I was that dude this is this rock star status is awesome little did I know what I was truly

[00:41:33] missing on I was missing on living I was not living I was dying now I'm living yeah so but I just I thought there's things just different they just there was something about them yeah yeah well

[00:41:48] and it's actually perfect that you can't explain it because now you know that it was intangible like yeah they they talk different than the other guys and all that but it was like man when you when you're

[00:41:58] when you're an unbeliever and you come across a believer if they're living right it should be kind of like that's why I like Krithi is because it's not like a oh I'm I'm

[00:42:08] drink of whatever cool it back I has it's just more like what what is it why is this guy weird but it's it's by the actions it's like that's a lot of a lot of church and Christianity and

[00:42:19] majority they do this they don't do a lot of walking they do not do they they talk and James talks about it be a be a talk a walker not a talker be a doers yeah my church we say don't just talk about

[00:42:31] it be about it be about it exactly that doesn't mean we don't go through trials yeah again back in James's find joy in the trials because we're about to level up you're being tested yeah and pass

[00:42:43] test yeah because there's blessings on the other side yeah so you find yourself in the marines you make your way to the navy and find yourself on team 2 you know go through green team and then

[00:42:58] team 6 and this amazing story but the undercurrent behind all that is that your life isn't just killing bad guys you have to go home and you're struggling with pills alcohol the relationships

[00:43:12] you're in marriages and many have these kids and now I mean just just so people are listening and they don't think that the story ends poorly I mean such a beautiful family now Amanda seems to be

[00:43:21] like an anchor for you it's incredible but you go through this whole thing but they're towards right in the about 10 years ago you begin to butt up against church because of some of the relationships

[00:43:32] you're in and you find yourself at a wild at heart retreat a John L. infantry which anybody who grew up in evangelical Christianity knows of John L. infantry or at least you know of wild at heart

[00:43:44] and it kind of changed the way men experience Christianity in a big way some people are probably critical of it but it's done a ton of good for for Christian men to realize like hey there's

[00:43:55] something more than I realized but I was blown away by something you said about being invited to church and I think at the time it was a girlfriend who was inviting you to church and you said I knew the

[00:44:07] things that I would hear at church that would strike me like a lightning bolt and I didn't want to hear it and then when you were at the retreat just having this experience right but I mean you're

[00:44:19] just really being confronted by God in this loving and general way you said that the first time you spoke to God not out of fear not when bullets are flying over your head but the first time

[00:44:28] you spoke to God in peace time we'll say is you said you know my past and you know how you scare me which I listened to that and I paused everything I was listening to and I was just like okay

[00:44:41] this is people people don't know people need to hear this but you know you now because of the military and now speaking to various backgrounds and experiences you're coming up against people

[00:44:55] I'm sure who are Christ curious like you were when you were talking to Adam they have serious spiritual questions but for similar reasons to you whether fear or anger they just refuse to interact

[00:45:08] with God in the church so what do we need to be saying to these people what do we need to be saying to these eddie pennies of 11 12 years ago who are like hey if you have an answer for me I'm listening

[00:45:19] but I'm pissed off I'm afraid you don't understand what what should the church be saying to these people and I understand all that like I was I was scared and again it's we have an enemy

[00:45:37] the world the flesh and the devil that is an enemy it's not this walk through life and just like let's go pick out some flowers and go eat some strawberries by the tree that unfortunately that's not it

[00:45:49] I would love that time but that will come but it's not it's not right now and it's not today is we have to learn the big picture God's purpose we are in a battlefield and you've got to

[00:46:01] treated us such that doesn't mean that we're going out and shooting dudes left and right that's how about that means but it does mean that spiritually we are attacked and what are there's a

[00:46:10] tax look like the bonded you are in for me was alcohol pills women like I've said a couple of times on here that was my bondage or just like couldn't talk about real stuff about people's feelings

[00:46:24] emotions getting down their level empathizing with them there was no like I was just like a block on me and until I got rid of that stuff I was like oh my gosh I have been missing out

[00:46:34] I think the big thing to answer the question is we need to speak truth and I think we got a quick sugar coding things. When I started speaking I was like I've got to attack the spiritual darkness

[00:46:49] and I heard from the Lord like you're going to be talking about the warrior piece that is what you'll be talking about and I heard it loud and clear and that was a little scary it's like

[00:47:00] you're going to go talk about because I remember going to church and barely ever hearing about it like my talk about the armor of God in the phoenix we might we might talk about a thing called an

[00:47:09] enemy and then we're moving on back to like the like let's protect our marriage and but the things that were they talk about protecting is if you don't know that someone's trying to rip your

[00:47:20] house apart and divide you you're going to fall you have got to know your enemy and how do how do we protect our house? So I was simply like I'm talking about spiritual darkness I'm

[00:47:33] going to talk about like hey if we send we choose to not forgive our generations or we go to certain places do certain things listen to certain stuff watch certain things that that is a

[00:47:41] gateway for spiritual darkness to come in and torment and I've ever from friends and some family members like hey you can't you can't go out of the gates like that you can't just start like

[00:47:51] that front of believer and I was like all I remember was hearing do you see where we are it's because we have taking that exact stance there needs to be a change there needs to no more fluff

[00:48:04] no more sugarcoat no one's lying it's like guys here's what we got I didn't make the rules this is what we have right now in front of you here's the ingredients now we gotta make the cake let's

[00:48:17] yeah like we that that is it and I remember here that I'm like this is a problem and like this is the problem we don't want to talk about this or they might say this they're going to say stuff

[00:48:27] no matter what I say it doesn't matter I know that I understand that I know some will look at me writing the face a good job Eddie and they have an arm behind their back and stand in me

[00:48:37] with a butcher knife in the back I know that and that's okay because I have a Lord it does it that's not my that's not my fight that's not my battle of fight I have my battle or

[00:48:49] blessing I guess you say is being obedient to the Lord if he tells me to speak on something that's what I'll speak on yeah I don't even need to understand it trust the Lord though your heart do not

[00:48:59] lean on your understanding but we need to speak truth we have got to speak truth because what's happening is we are sending women and children and men out on a battlefield without being able

[00:49:12] to protect themselves we are putting on the battlefield without armor without a weapon and they're getting slaughtered look at the divorce rate look at the adultery look at the crime look at the homosexual craft that's going on through our country look at the gender identity that's what

[00:49:28] happens when you don't speak truth the enemy comes in and he steals and he destroys and that's exactly what he's doing until we speak truth which is the word of God we will continue to

[00:49:41] be to the slaughter yeah and I completely agree and I think some of the fruit of your ministry already and it relatively short amount of time is that you've sat in front of me and we were you know

[00:49:54] a name that we've referenced quite a few times as your friend Sean who awesomened I hope I get the opportunity to talk to him and consider my brother in Christ because it sounds like

[00:50:04] like the potency of what you're talking about is evidence I can't make enough of it is evidence in that conversation was last the end of last year I think we talked in October to Vemba

[00:50:16] I believe okay and now just you know seven months later he's posted on social media about hey I'm reading the Bible and it will be this is the beautiful the highest truth and all this stuff

[00:50:27] I'm sure he's still got a ton of questions and you know but but ministries like yours ministry like A-Tap I think are are all set out to say hey we have a vision specifically I mean

[00:50:38] I know you're trying to reach men and women I'm trying to reach men and women but I have a heart for men and I know you have a heart for men who maybe have felt the way you felt which is the

[00:50:48] church didn't have anything for me but then also too what we see in guys like Sean is that I think more and more men specifically are waking up even if they're even if they're unbelievers are

[00:50:59] waking up to the to the reality that we're living in now which is like we've said a couple times hey I don't have to be a Christian to see the evil is real I don't have to be a Christian to see

[00:51:08] that truth is under attack to the point where they're saying people are saying there isn't such thing as truth so what's the vision for unafraid you know what's the vision for what

[00:51:17] you and Amanda are doing and your team's doing um that you want to see in 10 20 years I suppose not just like I said it's not just men I know it's men and women but what is the vision behind

[00:51:27] unafraid of what you guys are doing down there and what do you want to see the Lord what are you hoping the Lord does through that you know we first started it just like it started out as a

[00:51:35] t-shirt and then people are kind of reaching out like I'm struggling with this struggling with this then we started like a patreon page to try to fill guys now we're going Bible studies every week

[00:51:45] whatever I say my vision is I know that the Lord has something way bigger planned I know he does I I know he does what that is I don't know I confidently press in each day

[00:52:02] listening to what he wants to happen I asked like what I treat everything as a napl okay what's the app today like what are we going yeah and that's just the way we communicate and um

[00:52:14] I see growth I see good quality growth I don't see quantity I see quality growth I see men and women being changed families being changed what that what this myth it's so we're

[00:52:27] to say ministry what this ministry does I don't know he does I know he has a plan I I I know he has a plan from many prophetic sources outside of this I know that for a fact

[00:52:43] um we're just we're willing to do whatever he wants whatever he says if he says pack up a move here and and I know he'll make that happen if it's start this take down that that's what we'll do

[00:52:57] it's just whatever he says that's what we're doing but I see growth there will be growth good quality growth where families are going to be changing and just we're going to be saving souls

[00:53:08] host's rescue that's what we're doing saving souls we're adding you might not like to hear this especially today of all days but I do think you're a hero but not because of your military

[00:53:21] service I think that you are a prophetic voice join to the ranks of a lot of other prophetic voices in the church saying something that a lot of men are not willing to say but more men are

[00:53:33] going to be willing to say because you're saying it and so um I'm so appreciative and like I said me and my friends we're big fans but we're really appreciative of that voice coming from a guy like

[00:53:45] you who we think can say something and speak to stuff that some men just can't speak to and by the grace of God through a crazy wild wovenly intricate story that you have are now sitting here

[00:53:59] you know championing that kind of holiness and so I just want to say I think you are making a lot of people Christ curious and I imagine that thinking back to the experiences you've had

[00:54:09] about guys like Adam and the guys that you served with who did that for you I think you're doing that on a scale that most people don't ever do it and I don't say that once again to make you feel

[00:54:18] good I know that that's the last one. I appreciate your kind of voice buddy I appreciate thank you. Well um for listeners if you haven't already paused it and gone and checked out on a

[00:54:28] freight go listen to that episode of the Sean Ryan show and I'll link in the description to this episode some other ways that people can find out more about you follow you on Instagram follow your wife

[00:54:37] on Instagram just all these cool things you guys are doing we're going to link to all that in the show's description people made me make sure that they they follow you because I think you have a

[00:54:45] really exciting career how do you and so Eddie thanks so much for being on this episode it is really cool to talk to you and hope we get to do something like this again awesome thanks for having me appreciate it

[00:54:54] Thank you for listening to this episode of Basecamp if you want more help engaging the least reach people and the darkest places with the gospel I want to invite you to join the all things

[00:55:15] all people engage network by joining the engage network you will receive training in world view and world religions leadership discipleship evangelism and apologetics you'll also receive demographic analysis and outreach strategy that will help you to accurately target your city with

[00:55:34] the gospel and access to all of ATAP's educational materials if you want to learn more just go to allthingsallpeople.org and click on Engage Network thanks for listening I hope you love the show